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SheeverCorpse_Connoisseur 於 9小時前 發表
I’m all for hero diversity and stuff but Ithink a hero that ends up in 44% of all matches having a 54% win rate seems abit unbalanced.


sheeverMuzz0rr 81 指標 5小時前
I will never forget the day where - asSkywrath with the old Aghs which had his ult have no cooldown - I dropped 3Mystic Flares onto a Pudge only for him to deny himself through it. Screamedthe house down.

在天怒A杖大招无CD的年代,我曾经连着往一个屠夫身上扔了三个神秘之耀(大招),却发现这逼在我大招里从容地自杀了 —— 这让我至今无法释怀。绝望的我快把房子吼塌了。

I love IceIceIceApocsky_ [分數隱藏] 7 分鐘前
At least he didn't blade mail


sheeverKraivo [分數隱藏]5 分鐘前
As a Pudge player, I giggled.


twin-headed birbFalonefal 159 指標 9小時前
Due to the nature of hook, it's almostimpossible to properly balance this hero.
Same thing happened to Bat, due to thenature of lasso, it took ten thousand nerfs until the hero became somewhatbalanced.
It's funnier with Pudge, cause he firstreceived patches and patches of buffs until he became a goddamn monster.
I think maybe they should start with thesimple things, like just remove the extra magic resist from flesh heap and seehow that affects his winrate.


sampeckinpah5 166 指標 8小時前
the difference is even when batrider wasmassively strong, no one picked him in pubs but pros were all over him. and nomatter how bad pudge is, people will pick the hero in pubs but it would takeinsane buffs to make pudge a staple pro pick. when the situation is like thisit's hard to really uate the power level of this hero. he doesn't reallyfeel 'unfair' to play against most of the time, he takes some skillto play well and he is not really a core hero so he is a good pick in almostall games.


CorunRS 34 指標 8小時前
It's similar with what they did with Io ,one of the worst winrates in pubs but still nerfed due to how good it was inpro drafts, due to the nature of its abilities


paTrolling for SheeverSlocknog 39 指標 5小時前
screw hook, free permaslow at level 1 isthe real cancer with this hero. hook and dismember are 'i scale intoeverything no matter how shit my early game was but if it was good i will be agod even from pos 4/5'


Gerroh 29 指標 3小時前
free permaslow
Rot is definitely not free. He only winsthis exchange if his team outnumbers you, otherwise he loses hard.


нσи тяαѕнFatSloth 12 指標 3小時前
For real. The amount of people that justrun away instead of attacking and moving is unreal. You will win the level 1damage trade unless they outnumber cause of his awful armor.


GodBlessSheeverdraconid [分數隱藏] 6 分鐘前
funny that one time a lv1 pudge tried tokill my disco pony where we just both enable w and auto atk


afrojumper [分數隱藏]11 分鐘前
i saw him without a joke in almost every ofmy 10 last games. always in the same role. In a Tri lane, and he always get'sfirst blood against the offlaner.
He's insanley good in every stage of thegame...


vraey 2 指標 6小時前
I think another aspect that is important isjust how many games most people have played with/against pudge. There is moreof an understanding of what the hero brings to the game than most, it enablespeople to play around it more naturally than others.


dududududuPrimusSucks13 6 指標 2小時前
This is actually a very true and overlookedstatement, ive been playing this game for 4 years and pudge has always beingthere no matter what meta is, he is just a 'safe pick' in a way thatis not safe for your lineup.


GunslingerYuppi 1 指標 1小時前*
Sounds very true. For as long as I'veplayed I've seen pudge being popular. Does he deserve a nerf because he'splayed a lot? Maybe limit his availability rather than mess with the hero.Didn't he just get a nerf to hook? You can look at any stats and draw conclusionsbut they're not necessarily the right ones, your comment being a good example.I've played games where opponent pudge was more of free food than op and I'mmore happy when opponent has pudge than when my team has pudge.


ttongss 6 指標 3小時前
Saying Bat was/is impossible to balancebecause of lasso is a bit naive. Lasso is a powerful ability but isn't whatmakes Bat competitively viable or broken. The reason Bat has been so relevantfor so long is his amazing laning phase, and in prior versions of the game,jungle efficiency. Historically, Bat could reliably eek out the smallest amountof exp and gold from the offlane and turn that into a very fast blink andconvert that to map control
That's is what ice frog has continuallytargeted with Bat's nerfs. Lasso has barely been touched. Put lasso on anyrandom hero and I don't think they become insanely broken heroes. (Napalm onthe other hand...)
This is also why pudge has, historically,not been relevant despite him having some insane skills. No one has figured outhow to lane him or making him consistency impactful if he misses hooks. Thatbeing said, pudge has been buffed to oblivion so i think its not long untilsomeone figures this out

这是冰蛙在削弱蝙蝠时一直想要针对的点。而燃烧枷锁一直没怎么动过。我觉得把燃烧枷锁放在任何其他英雄上都不会比蝙蝠更加变态。(一技能粘性燃油是另一方面 ... )

twin-headed birbFalonefal 2 指標 2小時前
I think the frog first tried to nerf Bataround his lasso (vision range and lasso range) but then figured he couldn't doanything more without destroying the ability, so he nerfed bat's laning andgeneral farm-ability.
Some heroes have abilities that are justhard to balance (around), and you can't really change that certain abilitywithout people going 'well, I'll just pick something else then', so they haveto be nerfed in ways that aren't directly related to that ability, which makesthese heroes feel kinda clunky as there's so much focus on properly using thathero's 'hidden power' that you actually need to be abusing as a team, which iskind of hard in pubs.
Pudge is doing well so far, but I thinksoon he'll be nerfed in ways that aren't hook-related heavily, to the pointthat you will be required to land an above-average amount of hooks in the earlygame or become utterly useless.


BigEZ_ 5 指標 8小時前
IMO nerfing magic resist from Flesh Heapand the movement speed slow of for will help. But also the nature of Hook justdrags you out of position and ur fooked


they will all succumb to the broodrowfeh 2 指標 1小時前
What about lowering the damage on Hook? 400true damage is quite a lot


stolemyusername 2 指標 2小時前
If just level 1 rot was 15% slow it wouldput the hero down like 5%. Very fair nerf


MumrikDK 2 指標 6小時前
It's funnier with Pudge, cause he firstreceived patches and patches of buffs until he became a goddamn monster.
Wasn't he already a winning hero in pubswhen they started with the shitload of incremental buffs?
I believe Bat mostly has been a loser inpubs.


DHeighway 2 指標 4小時前
and they still make hook more gimmickystill with the addition of rune hooks, only making it harder for themselves


they will all succumb to the broodrowfeh 2 指標 2小時前*
Due to the nature of hook
I'm assuming you mean that's in the samecategory as something like Nether Swap or like you said, Batrider, whereforcing your enemy to be in a position he doesn't want to be in is incrediblystrong. Any skill that displaces enemy positioning will always be a strongspell.
So how about lowering the damage the Hookdoes? 400 Pure Damage at level 7 is, quite a lot, especially since the core conceptof the Hook is already very strong in in of itself.
like just remove the extra magic resistfrom flesh heap
I wouldn't say this is an example of a'simple thing', since Flesh Heap combos quite well with his own Rot.So it's like a double hit where magic damage nukers become stronger againsthim, and he himself got stronger against himself (lul).


crashlnds_player 5 指標 7小時前
I think move flesh heap magic resistance totalent might be nice. Nerf slow to scale with level 15/20/25/30% so he cantslow and hit at the same time early game.
Remove armor and spell lifesteal talents.Add 8 strength and flesh heap magic resistance as talent instead. So he have ahard time dealing with physical damage (he has pretty low armor) and having thesame magic resistance if he pick the talent.


penialito 5 指標 3小時前
Wow relax, dont kill the hero either. Pudgelacks movility, hp/mana regen, armor, has mana issues, hook is unreliable andulti is melé and very easy to disrupt


crashlnds_player [分數隱藏] 38 分鐘前
30% Slow early is way too much. I can seethat scaling it is necessary (maybe 20/30/30/30 instead) just no hit + slow atthe same time early.
If you say his weakness like that it iseasy to see I killed the hero. But if you look at old talent tree. He have his+5 armor talent at lv15 so you can kill him early game now he got +5 armor anda 13% spell lifesteal. Mana + Hp regen + Mobility problem is solve by Tranq +Clarity already because he's a roamer anyway so he should never get hit whiletraverse through the map. So what left is armor, unreliable hook, (his ult issomewhat balanced because it pierce spell immune and still heal him even thoughhe deal no damage).
So his weakness left aside from skillshotis armor. So ok we give him very early talent to solve his weakness and boomthat how you mkae hero that can be very good even though he does not have muchitems (he used to have to buy some armor to deal with physical damage nowtalent already cover it).


Finlay_Arthur 1 指標6小時前
Interestingly not picked or valued much inthe pro scene though.


4HeadXet 1 指標 3小時前
Due to the nature of hook
Pudge never had this high of a winrate, oreven such a high pickrate before. He's historically always hovered around 50%winrate and I think 30-35% pickrate. Recent changes and patches to the gamehave made him better overall. For example, status resistance from strength.
You could easily bring his winrate down anotch by changing something basic like reducing the slow from rot. I won't besurprised if we see a scaling slow on rot per level in the next patch.


imadirtycup 1 指標 2小時前
Pudge is good in low level pubs, butgarbage in the pro scene. Batrider was always picked/banned in pro games, sothat's why it was nerfed. Pudge is fine the way he is now.


twin-headed birbFalonefal 1 指標 2小時前
I mean, personally I haven't had problemswith Pudge, so, his slightly above 50% winrate doesn't bother me at all.


Pink Sheever BorderEtzlo 1 指標 2小時前
pudge has only been seeing buffs, so yeah


vornash2 1 指標 1小時前
Shorten the hook distance, do something.


SheeverInnocent_Au [分數隱藏] 24 分鐘前*
Agreed, Hook makes Pudge the safe pick nomatter what. It is the perfect tool in uncoordinated pubs.
Need to win a teamfight? Hook some and turnit into a 4v5.
Need to take high ground? Hook.
Need to defend high ground? Hook.
Roshan fight? You guessed it...
The hero requires ZERO communication andcoordination. He even has a 4 sec disable ffs, to give enough time to yourdumbass teammates to come to you to kill the hooked guy.


sheever!Jazzinarium 43 指標 8小時前
In the Divine bracket he has a 51.7%winrate which is pretty strong, but not outright broken. Some minor nerfs infuture patches should be enough (maybe stat gain? +3.5 str per level soundsridiculous).
Btw, speaking of Divine winrates, do youknow who has the highest? Huskar, at 58.6%.
FUCKING 58.6%.

在超凡入圣局(DOTA2 新天梯排位赛称号)里屠夫胜率是51.7%,挺强的,但还没到影响平衡的地步。以后几个版本里小幅削弱即可(可能砍一刀属性成长?每级+3.5力量有点儿太扯淡了)

Yapzor-GodRondariel 60 指標 7小時前
That's because last picking huskar againstsome lineups can almost guarantee a win if you know what you're doing.
Doesn't mean he's OP tbh although he is inan ok place for the first time in a while imo.


mrTang5544 7 指標 7小時前
when do i last pick huskar?


Yapzor-GodRondariel 21 指標 7小時前
When the enemy has mostly magic damage orlow disable lineups.
Alternatively if someone in your teampicked Oracle or dazzle. Basically don't pick him into pure damage or burstphysical damage lineups or lineups with long disables.


Eulslover 12 指標 7小時前
enemy having weak lanes/greedy cores (likeAM) also helps


Highcon1337 1 指標 2小時前
If i have lastpick and the enemy got nodissables, only slows and no axe im going huskar even to midlane, since hishardest counters are disarm and stuns. When the enemy team lacks that you canbasically end the game at minute 25 before the first heavens helbeard getsonline.


DamnThatsLaser 3 指標7小時前
In case you know what you're doing


I was blinking before everyoneelseifitsreal 7 指標 7小時前
Enemy has no pure damage (OD, Timber, etc.)and physical damage that can either be controlled (sven around gods strength)or doesn't come on line for a while (antimage, physical damage ember). Also nobloodseeker or axe. Also no illusion heroes.
Everyone always thinks 'I'll justitemize against him with silver edge,' but forgets that his ult purges thebreak in which case the enemy carry is a full item behind an already snowballhero.
The best Huskar games are ones where youhave a lineup that can end the game in 25 minutes.


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